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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internets about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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File: 1627519996107.jpg ( 105.87 KB , 2000x1533 , wilson-eugene-debs-loc-eug….jpg )

 No.408111

much of this is a copy paste from the burger thread decided to have a serious thread on the concept of patriotism and socialism

Anons reactionaries don't own patriotism!
Anons patriotism is a love for the people!
Anons the "nation" is it's people and it's health is it's people's health!
Anons these reactionaries claim to love our "nation" yet hate our people the proletariat
ANONS PATRIOTISM IS PRAXIS!!!
Anons don't let reactionaries define patriotism!!!
Anons the embodiment of love for the people, which are the proletariat has been embodied by the term patriotism. (Whether you like that or not)

Juche Love's patriotism, Cuba Love's patriotism, the USSR loved patriotism! The reactionaries want to label you "anti-patriotic", this is all a attempt to separate you from the people. Which is why they love the "Left's" anti-americanism. They then use their billionaire funded platforms, to say inflammatory rhetoric that since leftist hate America; they hate YOU the American citizens. We fall into this anti-americanism to easily. We are right to criticize, most this nations history and the bourgeoisie that have enabled it. Still the people of America see a attack on it's image to be a personal attack.

Remember the nation is the people, that embody it. The term patriotism is seen this way, by Americans and the world alike. (Again whether you like that or not)
The bourgeoisie has tried to tie themselves to this patriotic image. Actively using it to brow beat the left as anti-populous through this. This doesnt negate that they the bourgeoisie are fully the usurper's, exploiters, and Leach's of the whole of the nation. when I say nation think the people every time I say nation think the people! It is time to call reactionaries what they are FRAUDS! It is time to expose them for their hatred of the people again the proles.

They see the county as a symbol when it is the whole of law and control of economics. (You know the partnership of the bourgeois state with the bourgeoisie class) Nationalism to me is different then patriotism, is it not the case that nationalism is the worship of the symbolism of the nation? They love the flag, "the process" "the holy constitution document". We must show this as fake loyalty to the people. They are only loyal to symbols and their own self interest in profit. We must humanize patriotism to make it class based!
We must make that flag be the good of our history. The history of the labor movement, women suffrage, civil rights movement. Remember anons everything redeeming about America even to Normie's stems from the left!

This is also a thread to discuss the history of patriotism in 20th century socialism. Share quote's and events on countries and leaders views back then. Also I'm looking for a quote by comrade Kim Il-sung on patriotism.(maybe you know what i mean I hope)Comrades Total! Empathy or the people and the dictatorship of the proletariat the socialist nation that encases it, is the only way forward love your fellow prole like a Christian loves god!

Anons don't fall for their tricks to separate us from the working class, we do in fact represent!!!!!!!!!
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 No.408116

File: 1627520305000.jpg ( 23.12 KB , 400x400 , 1987432742305723.jpg )

Juche with American Characteristics by the next decade.
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 No.408121

I really hope you sexy Chad's wanna talk about this. The Left's total rejection of patriotism has been a huge win for the right and a out right disaster for us. We need to change course on this.
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 No.408129

File: 1627520634454-1.jpg ( 131.01 KB , 1600x937 , 4861.jpg )

>posting motherfucking Debs with bullshit Patriotism is praxis!
Revisionism is not praxis.
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 No.408138

TLDR is vid related.
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 No.408140

>>408129
Narrow minded you can only see patriotism as bourgeois nationalism not as socialist patriotism. What Debs speaks of is that fake bourgeois patriotism that worships the symbols not the people. Me and him are both Calling in question this fake fraud "patriotism" for a real one based in class solidarity. Words have whatever meaning grows to attach to them. We cab co-opt this term we are the actual ones fighting for our fellow citizen aren't we?
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 No.408144

>>408138
In a since the whole premise of my original post is that reactionaries are traitors to the people and we are the real fighter's for their interest. We are the patriots that care for our fellow man they are only fraudsters, grifters, and sellouts.
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 No.408147

Comrades I made this because I have a lot of righteous indignation inside of me
How can they have the nerve to call me the traitor
How can they have the nerve to say I'm the one that's not loyal to the prole aka the people.
They have left millions of Americans indebt homeless strung out on drugs without a future ruining so many lives yet I'm to believe they love this nation. NO I can not accept this.
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 No.408149

I agree with your posts OP, but take yourself a little bit less seriously and tone down the LARP, we are in an imageboard not at a rally.
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 No.408150

Patriotism isnt inherently reactionary or socialist.
It depends on the situation. Nothing wrong with patriotic action if it actually benefits the nation instead of its rulers.
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 No.408151

Death to America.
Death to Israel.
Death to Imperialism.
Death to Colonialism.
Death to Capitalism.
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 No.408154

>>408151
Off-topic but yes.
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 No.408158

Reminder that real American Patrotism is always Anti-Imperialist.
If you love your country stop the politician psychos from invading other countries and destroying other people's lives.
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 No.408160

>>408149
Anons of leftypol the Jannie bourgeois threaten to take all we have! We must stop the Jannie menace before its to late.
thunders applause and roaring from the posters
When will be to far? when will we say we've had enough abuse?
They ban us, they write snarky things under our post! They do it all FOR FREE!

sorry like I said had a lot of indignation inside me.
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 No.408225

File: 1627524323705.png ( 62.34 KB , 876x844 , 6450694069-045.png )

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 No.408880

>>408111
Left-wing nationalism/patriotism doesn't make any sense in the United States. Left-wing nationalism is the nationalism of the oppressed, while right-wing nationalism is the nationalism of the oppressors. To understand why left-wing American nationalism is impossible, let us first examine who precisely the "American nation" is. Here's some possible definitions:
-The government of the United States of America
-The people who live under the government of the United States of America
-The more privileged people (white, middle/upper class, native born, Anglophone, Christian, cishet, male, etc.) who live under the government of the United States of America

American nationalism pretty much always revolves around defending one or more of those above groups, whether it be against outgroups abroad or outgroups at home. These outgroups are almost always of lower social status, domestically and/or internationally, than the ingroup. Thus, American nationalism is pretty much always about a privileged status.

You may now ask, aren't they people in the United States who can be described as oppressed? Can't they practice left-wing nationalism. To answer the first question, yes, there are people in the United States who can be described as oppressed. However, this oppression almost always comes at the hands of other Americans, whether it be American police, American companies, American schools, American landlords, or other American institutions. They are not subordinated to other countries or to international institutions like the UN, NATO, WTO, World Bank, etc., as those countries and international institutions are by-and-large subordinated to the American state and American corporations.

As for the second question, there are some forms of left-wing nationalism that can be practiced in the United States. However, it isn't "American" nationalism, but rather nationalism specific to certain oppressed groups, like Blacks, Native Americans, and Hispanics.

Overall, there is no such thing as left-wing American nationalism.

>>408116
I can't imagine any scenario where Juche would be practical in the United States. It only makes sense in a weak, highly maligned pariah state. I can't imagine the United States ever being all three of those things.

>>408138
Caleb Maupin is a clown.
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 No.408902

It's only okay if it is done to build HAMMER CITY and the NEW AFRIKA.
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 No.408905

>>408880
You are a clown with your privilege olimpics piece of shit.
That said patriotism in the us doesn't make sense. Every were else in the world it kind of does
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 No.408928

File: 1627557010365.png ( 231.75 KB , 608x342 , 145872354892365923.png )

>>408880
If the US turned Communist, it would become a highly maligned, economically damaged after an hypothetical civil war and internally unstable pariah state with a divided military in the eyes of it's former Capitalist allies, hence becoming economically and geopolitically weaker and in need of Juche adapted to the American context in order to defend itself and other Communist nations, hence the 'with American characteristics'.
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 No.408931

You shouldn't be allowed to use words "patriotism" and "nationalism" on leftypol until you read all of this
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1913/03.htm
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 No.408971

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 No.408975

Gay
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 No.408987

>>408158
>Reminder that real American Patrotism is always Anti-Imperialist.
It almost never is anti-imperialist.
There is nothing patriotic about preventing own country from grabbing other country's resources.

You have leave materialism and go for morality to justify putting others' interests above your country.
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 No.408995

>>408111
Did you forget that time Debs said this:
>Americanism — what a meaningless phrase. Americanism, like charity, covers a multitude of sins. Americanism is the last refuge of the scoundrel in politics.
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 No.409014

shut the hell up crakkka
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 No.409028

>>408928
The United States is highly central to the global capitalist system, so if capitalism fell there, it would likely soon fall in much of the rest of the world, particularly the Western Hemisphere. There would be no more CIA and OAS to fight socialist movements in Latin America. America is in a far different geopolitical situation than, say, Korea prior to 1948.
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 No.409058

>>409028
The international Capitalist class would simply try to create a new center for Capital upon already pre-existing independent blocks like the EU.
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 No.409063

>>409058
Not sure if they could do that. Of course it is hard to say much since we no nothing of the circumstances surrounding a hypothetical switch to socialism in the United States.
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 No.409234

Anons I appreciate your criticisms, I will get back to all of you after work. My mind is open I only wanted to play the waters on this concept.
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 No.409286

>>409063
The only feasible way that Capitalists would be weakened enough to be overwhelmed by a Revolutionary movement is through fragmentation of the international capitalist bloc, something that we are seeing between France/Germany and the US.
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 No.409296

id rather not
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 No.409319

Patriotism is, and always has been, a tool of the right, for the right.

I can help my "nation", "people", whatever, but I'm not going to love it until they start showing improvement.
In case of "my nation", it has been on steady decline for years now. I'm not going to bend over for them and I certainly won't advocate for the bullshit the majority votes for.

If this makes me a bad leftist, then I'm fine with it. I prefer being a good person and a bad leftist than a shit person and a normie-approved leftist.
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 No.409534

You guys are right! patriotism in America is a bourgeois pathology. (I don't know what I was thinking) Words can not describe the hatred I have for these reactionary grifters, that claim to love this nation as they gut it.
FUCK THEM from the bottom of my heart.
My mom is disabled about to be homeless and is Trump Qtard. She desperately needed at least a socdem safety net. Yet she continues to fall for these grifters. Many family members brought to similar fates over and again.

Maybe we shouldn't embrace patriotism I see my errors, still they need to be labeled the frauds, huckster's, and grifters they are. We do need to call them out for their hollow supposed "patriotism". This is something the left needs to focus more on.
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 No.409838

Anons check out this thread >>409550
It's talking about similar things but in a more intelligent way give this anon your (you's)

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