No.408627
>>408552
>Your system is hated
Most of the countries where people lived under actually existing communism see this period as favorable compared to capitalism. In Russia for example Joseph Stalin has about 70 % public approval rating.
>that think communism means freedom and no governments
The Soviet Union had more freedom than the Tsarists empire for example, so it was definitely improving.
The ideological question you also have to ask is freedom for whom, in the capitalist system only people with enough money have freedom, people that are poor are extremely restrained. Capitalism is now the most widespread system in the world, and a unfathomably huge number of people have no freedom, they have to do as they are told just to get enough money to survive. If you look at the people at the lower third of society, they had a much easier time getting by under the socialist systems, which meant more freedom.
If you want to have this ideological debate framed in terms of freedom, i can accommodate. Socialists want to increase freedom by taking the power of capitalists to decide about surplus, and make that political, So that the interests of all or at least most people are taken into account when it comes to re-investing wealth that society has created. When a society reaches a sufficient level of development the freedom is increased by replacing money based accounting to human time and material resources based economics. That way nobody can cheat you out of freedom with financial shenanigans. Communists will eventually abolish the state, which is the part of the government that imposes upon you the rules of the dominant class in society. However states will not go away until after capitalism has ended because capitalist countries have always tried to attack communist countries, and that means state-power is necessary to mount a collective defense. The other part of the government that organizes civil life: that keeps the lights on and the trains running, that will not go away, to prevent the tyranny of structurlessness. If you go back to primitivism you will have less freedom, because all of these systems create a lot of freedom, like trains that can take you to places without much effort, or hospitals that keep you alive, you know that's kinda important for having freedom.