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File: 1627525871904.png ( 173.29 KB , 300x300 , ClipboardImage.png )

 No.117962[Last 50 Posts]

https://comraderene.wordpress.com/2021/01/04/paul-cockshott-an-intellectual-for-imbeciles/
Paul Cockshott claimed debunked.
>>

 No.117963

>One such example is Slavoj Zizek, who is nothing more than a dancing clown for intellectuals.
Holy fucking based, someone finnaly said it.
>>

 No.117972

Contrarianism is extremely prominent in both far left and far right. Once something becomes popular in an already splinter group, they have to create another splinter group within it.
I wonder why that is.
>>

 No.117974

File: 1627527065175.png ( 56.61 KB , 743x297 , qwe.png )

This is the most idiotic line of thought ive seen in weeks.
Stopped reading there.

And no, im not anti-trans. But the author is without doubt below average intellect.
>>

 No.117976

Based call out
>>

 No.118010

Very adolescent writing style.
This dude can't be out of highschool.
>Let me preface this by saying that the communist movement in the modern day suffers from a lack of leadership, particularly in the ideological sphere. The days are long gone when communists could look to the pages of Beijing Review or follow discussions in the CPSU for guidance. As a result of this, many philistines of all sorts have tried to fill this void, particularly academics, as their credentials and age grants them respect among young left-wing student activists. (One such example is Slavoj Zizek, who is nothing more than a dancing clown for intellectuals.) Paul Cockshott is one such academic, whose bigoted views on the LGBT workers are justified with the most embarrassing, flimsy argumentation that he is practically begging to be mocked. If Cockshott self criticizes, I would be delighted to see UK communists put his knowledge of computer science to work. If he does not, and continues to spread his reactionary views on LGBT and immigrants, and I am sure he will, his oeuvre can be totally discarded, since it amounts to little more than “socialism with computers.” (I seriously doubt there are any communists today who would deny the importance of modern technology in building socialism.) Nevertheless, let me begin by stating what should be the obvious conclusion for any communist confronted with the question of the LGBT community and communism.
<After babbling he gets to the point
<Muh trans (is THE MSOT IMPORTANT IM NOT A CRYPTO-LIBERAL WITH ASPIRATIONS IN THE JOURNALISM INUDSTRY)
<Reduces his writings and casually discards it as just being about "computers", neglecting that it's primarily about how to actually get successful planning, with good economic research behind it, going the next time we have the chance, with labor credits, etc.
The dozens of paragraphs following is just that.
<SEX AND GENDER
<SEX AND GENDER
<SEX AND GENDER
<SEX AND GENDER

Despicable blog pseud.
>>

 No.118033

<If Cockshott self criticizes, I would be delighted to see UK communists put his knowledge of computer science to work. If he does not, and continues to spread his reactionary views on LGBT and immigrants, and I am sure he will, his oeuvre can be totally discarded, since it amounts to little more than “socialism with computers.
If the computer stuff by that author is too banal, how would changing the opinion on another topic make the computer stuff delightful? This is incoherent.

<Premise 1: Trans people are overwhelmingly workers
<Premise 2: Communists fight for the workers
<Conclusion: Communists fight with/for trans people
This is too broad. Since workers are a huge group, you will find all sorts of interests and hobbies in there, and by following the steps of above thinking recipe you can arrive at almost anything that we "must" support, for example Catholicism.

<labor aristocratic nature as a first world academic limits his outlook and permeates his writing with all manner of petty-bourgeois prejudices.
Where is the evidence that the criticized view on LGBT is
-less common among people in developing countries
-less common among lower-income people
-less common among non-academics?
I am pretty sure the opposite is the case for each of the three aspects.

<There is a great deal of overlap in the US between the anti-LGBT “communists” and the anti-BLM…
That's just a lazy argument by association.

<The notion that homosexuality is bourgeois degeneracy being pushed by the bourgeoisie exactly mirrors the fascist mantra, replacing Jews with the bourgeoisie.
You can use pseudo-arguments of this form to evoke a general similarity between people with class analysis and nazis as both being "totalitarian".

<Paul argues that working-class people are more likely to be hostile to homosexuality. Once again, Paul betrays his total ignorance of Leninism by seemingly endorsing tailism! The attitude of the workers at any one moment tells communists nothing.
Premise 1: Globally, most workers think that traps are gay. Premise 2: Communists fight for the workers…

The author claims repeatedly that gays/trans are more exploited than other workers and then of course there is some coomer stuff about how sex work is heckin valid work because giving birth is work.

This is so poorly thought out one might think it's a parody, but because of the extreme length I think the author is genuinely mentally ill.
>>

 No.118045

>>117962
>basic marxist analysis of immigration is reactionary
dumb

this is a fair criticism however:
>Cockshott is unwilling to turn class analysis inwards, that is, examine how is own labor aristocratic nature as a first world academic limits his outlook and permeates his writing with all manner of petty-bourgeois prejudices.

>>117974
yes, the same argument could be applied to pedophiles and reactionaries
>>

 No.118064

>ctrl-f search for
<planning
<matrix
<input
<output
<algorithm
>0 results
why are you posting this pseud?
>>

 No.118065

>>118010
>>118033
Cockhotts LGBT stuff is 100% retarded but this isn't a good critique of it, unfortunately.
In general I find cockshott to be an idiot, but this isn't a good critique.
>>

 No.118066

Cockshott's debunks of antimaterialist gender spookery and his material analysis of LGBT are decent but his conclusions are peak boomer.

>>118010
This, basically.

>>117963
But also, this, though.
>>

 No.118068

>>118066
his material analysis was straight up calling most lgbt members 'not workers' it was the worst thing i ever read, and actually sullied his better stuff like his pretty decent write-up on the transformation problem

Dude is just a boring leninist who can only think in terms of politics, the future has already left him - while the blogs author is equally obsessed with recreating history they at least are right that 'socialism with computers' is kinda a banal unnecessary avenue for the left outside of educating new communists on some of the intricacies of marxist economics (of which there are far better blogs than dickblast's)
>>

 No.118069

>>118010
>>118033
>cope cope cope
Damn, just because he criticized idiotic views that you happen to share with weenieballs, you have to disregard logic and pathetically grasp for straws.

This may not be the best criticism of dickblast, but your """criticism""" of said criticism is well below it in quality.

I mean, how could a self-respecting pseud write obviously idiotic shit like
><Paul argues that working-class people are more likely to be hostile to homosexuality. Once again, Paul betrays his total ignorance of Leninism by seemingly endorsing tailism! The attitude of the workers at any one moment tells communists nothing.
>Premise 1: Globally, most workers think that traps are gay. Premise 2: Communists fight for the workers…
At this point you may as well say that
>communism rewards diesel engine because they do the most "work" AKA labor
Your babbling could convince a /pol/tard, but only that.
>>

 No.118080

>>118069
Ironic.
>>

 No.118081

Out of curiosity, is there any evidence that most trans people are working class?
>>

 No.118096

>Communism is for us not a state of affairs which is to be established, an ideal to which reality [will] have to adjust itself. We call communism the real movement which abolishes the present state of things. The
so true!!!
>btw here's my ideal system of planning for the state of affairs we're going to establish
yes, excellent, this is exactly what is needed. just as soon as someone re-starts the USSR this will be very helpful.
>>

 No.118115

>>118081
most people are working class and trans people actually make significantly less money on average than cis people, even though they have to pay for trans shit out of pocket a lot of the time
>>

 No.118117

>>118115
Shitcoms think that if you don't work physically, you're a bourg.
>>

 No.118120

>>118117
lot's of trans men especially are manual labourers tho
>>

 No.118124

>>118081
https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/resources/NTDS_Report.pdf
Page 2 or 8, depending on whether your pdf reader
Later they show that they had educated whites overrepresented in the sample, but still making less money than average.

Weird thing is that FtM, which are 40% of the sample, were discriminated against less and were better educated, but still ended up making less money.
>>

 No.118140

>>117963
What have you read by Zizek?
>>

 No.118145

I appreciate Cockshott's work regarding cybernetic socialism and "empirical" marxism, but man the phase were I saw him as an unshakable pillar of knowledge are definitely over. I mean…the guy is such a retard at times
>>

 No.118152

File: 1627557514448.jpeg ( 20.17 KB , 474x387 , tea-contemplation.jpeg )

What is it even that Cockshott has written on LGBTQ that is supposed to be so damn controversial? What have I missed? The parts I've read from him on the subject is very expected, it's standard radical positions of the time of his generation's youth (which were far more revolutionary and far-seeing than we milleniall and zoomer generations turned out to be), namely radical feminism of the class-based Marxist feminist variety, he by extension critiques gender as false consciousness like a Marxist.

Now if I'm not proven wrong and he is in fact the stoning-advocating 15th century priest that you guys are twitter hot-taking about ITT and whenever this subject comes up, then do prove it with the given paragraphs I've missed, with the source text linked.

But right now I've started to lean on the assumption that this is all just a bunch of young new leftists, with very little self-awareness, chastising materialists for not going along with hegemonic "progressive" (for the bourgeois) LGBTQ norms (supporting gay marriage is a prime example of liberal progressivism having nothing to do with materialist socialist aims of abolishing the institution of marriage), ultimately rooted in idealism and actualizing false consciousness in the working classes.
>>

 No.118153

>>118152
>radical feminism
>Marxism
pick one
>>

 No.118155

>>117962
Dumb criticism of something completely inessential. The problem with Cockshott is that's he's an anti-dialectical positivist. What is commonly referred to as "anglo autism".

But still, he's a useful tool against other fachidiots claiming you can't have an economy without a market. You won't easily convince them of their whole framework being wrong, it's easier to just hand them Cockshott since he starts from the same framework but arrives at an alternative solution.
>>

 No.118158

>>118152
>supporting gay marriage is a prime example of liberal progressivism having nothing to do with materialist socialist aims of abolishing the institution of marriage
the difficulty is thus: marriage should be abolished, but there is a segment of the left with the kind of brain-worms that makes him say "marriage should be abolished, and so while the institution of marriage exists, it should not be extended to gays" instead of "marriage should be abolished, but while the institution of marriage exists it should be operated equitably."

not as part of any cynical game playing (maybe we can get the gays who just want to see their sick partners to advocate for marriage abolition!), but purely out of idiocy: to let the gays marriage would mean "more marriage", which is bad, because marriage is bad. the poofs should just suck up the practical consequences of not being allowed to marry, or better yet, embrace that they are the vanguard of freedom from marriage! freedom!
that's before you get into the utter foot-tripping brainworms of "marriage should be abolished, but the purpose of marriage is to encourage childrearing, which poofs can't do, so we shouldn't give it to them", which is the kind of idiocy you can only get by working back from not liking poofs.
>>

 No.118164

>>118158
>which is the kind of idiocy you can only get by working back from not liking poofs
This is what peepeepoopoo and other fake leftists actually do.
If you look at dickblast's arguments and change, say, "trans ideology" for pretty much anything else similar, he'd handwring and deflect all day.
>hispanic ideology is erasing blackness! "black" hispanics aren't really black, they are just acting black. recently, a black man was fired by BLM witch hunt because he dared to bring up the biological fact of race.

All of his bullshit only makes sense if you start with
>LGBT BAD
and walk backwards to find reasons for why could that be, making sure not to ever contradict the axiom in the process.

>>118155
>Dumb criticism of something completely inessential
Your criticism is indeed dumb, but pointing out someone's complete lack of reliability is not inessential.
>>

 No.118166

>Leftypol becomes radlib hellhole
You hate to see it folks
>>

 No.118168

>>118153
>LGBT idpol
<Marxism
Pick one
>>

 No.118173

>>118168
I don't give a shit about that either anon
>>

 No.118174

File: 1627560201755.png ( 7.78 KB , 400x400 , re-desktop-03.png )

You're all dodging so far. What's the egregious fundamentalist Christian writing from Cockshott that I've been missing?

>>118153
Yes both first and second wave feminists were on the same side with Marxists many times during the 20th century. Cope, etc.
>>118155
Positivism is opposed to materialism and if you had any familiarity with his writings you would know that Cockshott is as materialist as they come, you stupid Infratard. Keep soyfacing while reading Fanged Noumena in front of your Shanghai wallpaper (congrats on the city recently being deregulated btw! Praise Xi!).
>>118158
By this bulletproof logic we should all just become social democrats. Talk about "brainworms", Mr. Bernstein!
>>

 No.118175

>>118145
Does he have anything non-retarded to say nowadays?
Seems that all his newest shit is a bunch of picked cherries about how ebil LGenderBT agenda oppresses poor transphobes, preventing them from saying OBJECTIVE FACTS like "my definition is objectively correct and my definition is that you are unworthy of being alive".

It's sad to see so many old people literally stop being able to revise their worldview according to newly available facts.
>>

 No.118176

>>118173
Don't reply to the retard, you're bringing quality down by encouraging dumb posts.
>>

 No.118194

>>118174
>Yes both first and second wave feminists were on the same side with Marxists many times during the 20th century. Cope, etc.
if you count "expelled from the First International" then sure
never forget that first wavers like Pankhurst also supported the Great War on the cynical belief that it would give them the vote and encourage women to enter the work force, further justifying the bourgeois state and increasing the exploitation of the proletariat
>>

 No.118197

>>118175
Literally lying. How much is the lobby paying you to post on your bourgeois IDpol safe space here on /b/? How long has this been going on? Of course honesty would jeopardize your source of income.
>>

 No.118199

>>118194
>404: Reading comprehension not found
>>

 No.118210

>>118174
>Positivism is opposed to materialism
There are a lot of positivists that are materialists. Daniel Denett or Bertrand Russell for example. Positivism is opposed to dialectical logic, that I'll give you
>>

 No.118217

>ctrl+f "trans"
>67 matches
Yep don't care
>>

 No.118226

>>118197
>ur a shill because you don't like my idpol
Now that's new.
>>

 No.118230

transhumanists are going mask off, at least before they pretended to be leftists/feminists, now it's full homofascism mode
>>

 No.118234

>>118232
yes, an accurate summation of modern cockshott.
>>

 No.118249

>>118174
>You're all dodging so far.
Hypocrite.
>What's the egregious fundamentalist Christian writing from Cockshott that I've been missing?
Let's see
>British state sponsored homosexual movement
Complete boogieman "from the outside", exactly like how catholic church envisions "gender agenda", except this time it's "funded by the government" somehow.
>What is not in doubt is the out and out bourgeois reactionary character of this movement in western countries where it spreads divisive identity politics, sides with the employers against workers, spreads the most crass idealism, and stoops to neofascist violence against proletarian women’s movement.
DARVO through and through.
>Those [LGBTQ] rights are not threatened in Europe
Only a retard would agree. It might have been before orban went full retard, but catholic bullshit in poland is nothing new.
>Pass a law to stop Priests buggering novices, well that is going too far, that is inexcusable.
Excuses a sweeping law against homosexuality by saying it's actually an anti-pedo law. Somehow this is the exact same "logic" as orban.

I know you're a malign agent and will move the goalposts, as can be clearly seen from your other posts, but I'm posting this just in case someone actually cares about the truth and not just furthering idpol.
>>

 No.118258

>>118081
More left-handed people are working class than bosses or landlords.
>>118152
The thing is people care about money. And they often don't talk openly about it, but instead put that in flowery language about freedom and progress and what have you. The thing they are offended about is that Cockshott does not want to subsidize them. But if they say it openly they can't get broad support, so they either keep the demands nebulous when talking about tose who stand in the way of gibmedats or just lie.
>>

 No.118260

>>118258
>The thing they are offended about is that Cockshott does not want to subsidize them.
From purely objective view, subsidizing transitions ends up saving a lot of money compared to increased suicide(+depression/anxiety/etc.) rate from denying transition.

It just doesn't sound nice from some idealist, immaterial points of view.
>>

 No.118262

>>118045
>muh prejudices
fuckng idpol
>>

 No.118264

>>118152
/thread
ban all idpoler
>>

 No.118265

>>118164
except contrary to race which is a pure spook, gender stem from a biological reality that affect the material need of peoples. retard. I have no significant difference with a black guy that would differentiate our material needs, but a woman does, if only cause she bleed every month and can bear children.
>>

 No.118266

>>118249
wow what a bad fath and guilt by association argumentation

>muh boogiemen
>idpol is actually not divisive lib tactic guys!!
>muh darvo
>lgbt rights objectively keep advancing since 20 years

fuck off retard, come back when idpol doesnt obsess your brain and you can start thinking in material reality and class
>>

 No.118268

>>118266
the material reality is that you're gay
>>

 No.118270

>>118265
>race which is a pure spook
Skin color alone changes vitamin D production.
Materialist excuse is there. If you were applying your retardation consistently, you'd also apply it here.
>if only cause she bleed every month and can bear children
Oh right, that certainly is a reason to apply massive gender essentialist bullshit to everyone, from infertile women who don't bleed (this includes most trans women, but also some cis women) to single fathers.
Some blacks are criminals, so material reality is that we must 14/88!

>>118266
>so what is conservative christian about cock?
<here's a list
>OUEUGHH it's guilt by association when you point out he uses fascist arguments!
>also disregard all problems that aren't 200% class, arbitrary distinctions are very Marxist, t. white cishet male pedophile
Same shit every day.
When will you learn?
>>

 No.118274

writing a materialist justification of my belief that anyone who uses a tenkeyless keyboard should be beaten to death with it.
>>

 No.118277

>>117974
Trans people are overwhelmingly labour aristocrats
>>

 No.118280

>>118277
post union card
>>

 No.118283

>>118277
Log off, retard.
>>

 No.118285

File: 1627566283949.jpg ( 30.9 KB , 522x399 , re-desktop-04.jpg )

>>118249
Not a single source for your statement.
How curious. It's almost like you don't want us to read the full context of these snippets you've sniped while construing this smear of yours.

>British state sponsored homosexual movement
Literally true. As do most bourgeois states in the west today. Not even controversial, it's become the fucking norm.
>What is not in doubt is the out and out bourgeois reactionary character of this movement in western countries where it spreads divisive identity politics,
Unarguably, leftypol has been in agreement with this since its inception practically.
>sides with the employers against workers,
I've seen this with my own eyes.
>spreads the most crass idealism
exactly what transgenderism is
>and stoops to neofascist violence against proletarian women’s movement.
many documented cases, only increasing with time.

Not looking too good for your side in this argument. Very flimsy. Also alien to this community in how you valorize idealism and liberal IDpol so thoroughly. Where did you fly in from?
>>

 No.118286

>>118277
post paycheck, rent, and country of residence
>>

 No.118288

File: 1627566382964.png ( 766.43 KB , 1200x675 , 1200px-Serena_Braixen.png )

>>118174
>>118285
get a better avatar
>>

 No.118291

>>118285
>just plain lies and defense of idpol
My last reply to you, at least until you get less retarded b8.
>>

 No.118296

File: 1627566498860.jpeg ( 30.88 KB , 634x331 , mija.jpeg )

REJECT COCKSHOTT RIGHT NOW!!
>>

 No.118298

>>118291
>biofemales are IDpol and should be discarded
>transhumanists, however, we should abandon Marxism for!
Such wow, much pog
>>

 No.118299

^ he uses tenkeyless
>>

 No.118300

>>118299
>tenkeyless
WTF is this?
>>

 No.118301

>>118300
He's just trying to distract.
It's a type of keyboard with less keys (ten less keys).
>>

 No.118302

>>118300
reddit keyboard without a numpad, if you ever see someone using one break it over their head
>>

 No.118303

>>118301
>He's just trying to distract.
Well, he's talking about a drooling mong poster, so being distracted from this shit is beneficial.
>>

 No.118304

>>118260
>From purely objective view, subsidizing transitions ends up saving a lot of money compared to increased suicide
This has to be the most neoliberal sentence in the history of imageboards:
1. It's an argument about money above everything in a context where it is absolutely secondary to anybody who isn't a psychopath.
2. It's free of empirical evidence.

People who undergo sex reassignment surgery are far more likely to commit suicide than the general population:
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0016885

You may argue that the suicide rate would have been even higher without the surgery, but consider the following: About 88 % of kids with gender dysphoria cease to have it when they grow older:
https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=90229789

And of course you don't have one transition surgery, but a series of surgeries and potential follow-up surgeries and you must take medications for the rest of your life, so your money argument is false on top of being tasteless.
>>

 No.118305

>>118303
Take the L
>>

 No.118307

File: 1627567485823.jpg ( 89.29 KB , 1280x720 , maxresdefault.jpg )

>>118304
>so your money argument is false
doesn't actually follow.
>>

 No.118309

>>118304
>https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0016885
>Setting
>Sweden, 1973-2003.
<1973-2003
That's like arguing that blackness is a mental illness because 100 years ago, blacks were much more stressed than whites.
Discrimination against people who don't conform to assigned gender has improved greatly in recent years.
>You may argue that the suicide rate would have been even higher without the surgery
Yes, this is the consensus of psychiatrists on the topic.
>About 88 % of kids with gender dysphoria cease to have it when they grow older
And yet regret rate for transition is below 5%, with majority being happy about it.
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-014-0300-8
>There were 15 (5 MF and 10 MF) regret applications corresponding to a 2.2 % regret rate for both sexes. There was a significant decline of regrets over the time period.

>so your money argument is false
Oh right, a dead person produces so much extra money!
And labor, if you want it restated in friendly terms, even though everyone knows what I meant.
>on top of being tasteless
You're grasping at straws here.
The tasteless part here is blaming the victim for their suicide.
>>

 No.118316

File: 1627568307802.jpeg ( 70.9 KB , 620x675 , 194E4024-83CB-434A-AF94-8….jpeg )

>>118296
YES MASTER
FUCK PAUL “ANGLO BOX DICKBLASTING” C*CKSH*TT
FUCK M*RXISM-L*NINISIM

UP WITH ANARCHO-BOOKCHINISM-GRAEBERISM-OCALANISM-VAUSHISM BIDEN THOUGHT
>>

 No.118317

>>118309
This. Also trans kids generally are different from gender non conforming cis kids in that they exhibit a strong feeling of having a different gender than the one they were assigned from birth, and that feeling continues throughout life. There are predictable trends for what kids will pursue a medical transition later in life when they are able to. And most trans people experience reduced dysphoria and an increased quality of life from transitioning
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2019/01/young-trans-children-know-who-they-are/580366/
>>

 No.118318

denying a kid transition is not the moral high ground either, plenty of trans kids kill themselves when they are not able to transition and find proper acceptance and support
>>

 No.118319

File: 1627568592154.jpeg ( 26.16 KB , 274x363 , F5D8DD51-80B7-4E2B-B758-9….jpeg )

>>118317
Was this a thing before the modern day discourse, i.e. the 2000s?
>>

 No.118323

no, before then you had to wear blue if you were a boy and pink if you were a girl
>>

 No.118324

>>118323
for >>118319
>>

 No.118326

File: 1627569049001.jpeg ( 23.37 KB , 480x350 , 2957D2D1-1F05-456A-A87F-4….jpeg )

>>118318
>>118323
So before, again, the 2000s, how many people actually killed themselves over this? Because, to me, this almost entirely seems to be a phenomenon of this century, cross dressing existed prior to the 2000s, but it was not pathologized to this degree, not even people that did go to the extent of identifying as the opposite sex seemed to pathologize their lifestyle to the degree that people currently do, you’re telling me in all honesty this was always a thing?
>>

 No.118327

>>118326
A Change of Sex is a multi-part television documentary about English trans woman Julia Grant. The first chapter, initially titled George, premiered on BBC2 in 1979. It is one of the first documentary films about transgender issues.

BBC2 repeated the programme in 1980, followed by two new chapters, Julia: The First Year and Julia: My Body, My Choice. A revised version aired in 1994, accompanied by another new chapter, The Untold Story, which updates viewers on Julia's life of the past 15 years. The final instalment, Julia Gets Her Man, followed in 1999. David Pearson directed the films.

Julia Grant was born in 1954.[2] The documentary introduces us to her as George Roberts, a catering manager. Although she performs as a drag queen, George says she has never felt at home in gay male culture. She feels inside that she is a woman, and she wishes for sex reassignment surgery. The National Health Service refers her to the Gender Identity Clinic at Charing Cross Hospital. As she sits in the consulting room, we hear the voice of her psychiatrist, but we never see his face. His attitude toward Grant is stern and disparaging.[3] His deskside manner was the inspiration for the character Dr Ira Carlton, a "despotic GP who rules his patients with eccentric zeal" in the black comedy series The League of Gentlemen.[4]

Beyond the consulting room, the filmmakers follow Julia through her experiences of hormone therapy, shopping for women's clothing, gender confirmation surgeries,[5] her professional life, and other dimensions of her transition.
>>

 No.118329

>>118327
You don't answer his question at all

He asked you how many died because of this. People explain this situation as a pandemic now yet where with these issues before this millennium that were life and death for people? Present the evidence
>>

 No.118330

>>118329
Where was this issue*
>>

 No.118331

File: 1627569490724.gif ( 185.83 KB , 220x189 , tenor.gif )

>>118329
>He asked you how many died because of this
no, he asked somebody else.
>>

 No.118332

>>118331
A documentary of 1 person has no relevance here. That is called a case study.

This is discussing a societal problem you need to present the larger picture of this being a large scale epidemic previously for people in past eras
>>

 No.118333

File: 1627569698542.gif ( 133.27 KB , 320x180 , 28c624f36e7b6f4c0921693e35….gif )

>>118332
i don't need to shit bitch
>>

 No.118334

>>118326
>how many people actually killed themselves over this?
Hard to count them because admitting to being transgender was social suicide already. Only the most desperate or reckless would do it.
>cross dressing existed prior to the 2000s, but it was not pathologized to this degree
You can thank rightard idpol for pathologizing it.
Including fake leftists who just parrot rightard idpol, thinking you're free from it as soon as you say "race don't matter".

>>118329
>People explain this situation as a pandemic now
Rightards see it as a pandemic, yes, but this is because they want to see it that way.
Leftists see it as "2% of the population expresses their biology that they had to hide before, nothing to see here".
>>

 No.118335

>>118333
Because you don't have shit

I could just as easily post evidence of a anti psychotic curing gender dysphoria in a case study. Case studies are meaningless here

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8839957/
>>

 No.118336

File: 1627569885686.gif ( 1.06 MB , 500x270 , 17b.gif )

>>118335
i have a gif collection and some TV recommendations
>>

 No.118338

>>118334
No you yourselves see it as a pandemic.

You argue people NEED these surgeries or they will commit suicide. You present it as a life or death situation with no out.

Where is the evidence that these people existed before these surgeries existed? That we had people killing themselves because incapable of developing a vagina or having a penis?

Present it
>>

 No.118341

Cockshott's area of expertise is economic planning and calculation. We should not judge him for his old-fashioned thinking, but it would be better if he did not spend all his time arguing about transgenderism on twitter.
I'm trans and i like him.
>>

 No.118345

>>118176
I feel like the amount of time and energy he dedicates to being a terf while cringe is being vastly over stated by his detractors.
>>

 No.118347

>>118345
Meant for >>118341
>>

 No.118348

>>118152
I like how nobody gave you an answer. Just so you know, the actual answer is in Cockshott's blog.
>>

 No.118349

>>118348 (me)
To be clear, I disagree with Cockshott. He does that thing in some of the posts where he cherrypicks these obscure research papers to try and force a point that gay people are supposedly wealthier.
>>

 No.118351

>>118280
>>118283
>>118286

They coped because he told the truth.
>>

 No.118352

>>118351
Also I’m not the other brocalist itt, he’s posting retarded shit.
>>

 No.118353

aren't you that guy who simps for the meme australian
>>

 No.118354

File: 1627571503178.png ( 1.48 MB , 1168x1252 , ClipboardImage.png )

>>118277
>Trans people are overwhelmingly labour aristocrats

bitch
>>

 No.118356

>>118301
>>118302
so a laptop keyboard?
>>

 No.118357

>>118356
same layout, but a separate device
>>

 No.118358

File: 1627572408423.gif ( Spoiler Image, 27.52 KB , 507x559 , real me.gif )

>>118334
>Leftists see it as "2% of the population expresses their biology that they had to hide before
That's right. Here I am, out and proud! Tell me I'm pretty.
>>

 No.118359

>>118338
>No you yourselves see it as a pandemic.
Sure thing, rightard.

>You argue people NEED these surgeries or they will commit suicide. You present it as a life or death situation with no out.
Strawman.
People whose gender identity doesn't match one assigned at birth are at significantly higher risk of suicide.
Are you disputing this? This is common knowledge, but if you need a proof that water is wet, I'll provide it.
Those people existed long before modern times. Need proof that Earth is round?

>That we had people killing themselves because incapable of developing a vagina or having a penis?
You moved the goalpost to Mars by asking for something incredibly specific.
You want something that:
>would be very shameful to admit
>would most likely happen in times when literacy wasn't a given
>would not provide any advantage to share
>necessarily ends in suicide

Meanwhile basic logic clearly implies from
>people who are more stressed have a higher risk of suicide
>people who have to fake someone they aren't out of risk of violence or social shame are more stressed
>gender dysphoria was known before the first surgery
We get
>people who have gender dysphoria were at higher risk of suicide before first surgery was performed

Also, you're pretending that hormonal therapies don't exist and only surgeries matter, while majority of trans people never get a surgery.
>>

 No.118362

>>118359
>This is common knowledge, but if you need a proof that water is wet, I'll provide it.

Go ahead and provide proof I'll wait for you here that's what I requested
>>

 No.118363

>>118362
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7317390/
>The mean number of suicides in the years 2013–2017 was higher in the trans population (40 per 100 000 person years; 43 per 100 000 trans women and 34 per 100 000 trans men) compared with the Dutch population in this time frame (11 per 100 000 person years; 15 per 100 00 registered men and 7 per 100 000 registered women)
There, evidence that trans people are at higher risk of suicide.
>>

 No.118365

>>118363

This was never my request. This was a thought you pushed into conservation yourself

The evidence i requested was this

>Where is the evidence that these people existed before these surgeries existed? That we had people killing themselves because incapable of developing a vagina or having a penis?

This is what I'm requesting evidence for
>>

 No.118368

>>118365
Learn to read. Read what you quoted.
>>

 No.118369

>>118368
Are you going to provide any evidence yes or no?

I don't care at all for your theories of the world you formulate. Show me evidence on paper that people experienced genital issues that led to suicide before these surgeries existed.

If you are not going to do this carry on
>>

 No.118371

>>118369
You disagree with the logic itself, at this point there could be no evidence to convince you, in this world or any possible - or impossible - world.
>>

 No.118372

suicide fact: the cause of suicide is always recorded using a big mind reading machine. if you push someone to suicide, the machine will know and tell everybody. but then, if you push them, it wasn't really a suicide, it was a murder.
>>

 No.118373

>>118371

So no evidence to provide alright moving on
>>

 No.118375

>>118363
<However, the suicide risk in transgender people is higher than in the general population and seems to occur during every stage of transitioning.
How does this work as an argument for supporting transitioning over the alternatives of not doing anything or changing the hormone balance in the other direction?
>>

 No.118376

>>118359
And how do you know that the suicide rates are due to society not being understanding enough rather than being due to mental illness?
Schizophrenics also have a higher rate of suicide than the general population, as due people with conditions like BPD, etc.
>>

 No.118380

>>118375
It doesn't compare the numbers, just says
>it's non-zero at all times

Here they do compare numbers:
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs11606-015-3529-6
>Lundstrom and by Kuiper and Cohen-Kettenis estimated that suicidality in transmen dropped from 20 % to 1 % after treatment
It's hard to find a good apples-to-apples comparison when it comes to suicidality, though there's a lot of data on the sub-factors, like quality of life or depression.
>>

 No.118381

This seems more like seething than actual criticism
>>

 No.118382

kek
>>

 No.118383

>>118376
>And how do you know that the suicide rates are due to society not being understanding enough rather than being due to mental illness?
Never said it isn't.
It's well documented that supportive environment is helpful at reducing suicidality.

Still, gender dysphoria is known to cause, well, dysphoria, which in turn has a causal link with depression and suicide.
I don't know if anyone documented effects of supportive environment on gender dysphoria, but there's plenty of evidence that saying
>just b urself, you don't need to be other gender
is not helping in the slightest.
>>

 No.118389

File: 1627575632145.jpg ( 58.32 KB , 1024x576 , shoock-1024x576.jpg )

>person had flawed opinions and beliefs
picrel
we might as well start cancelling every single communist in existence at this point

to whoever keeps endlessly making these stupid pointless threads: i used to care about trans issues but now i dont. thank you for enlightening me to the freedom of apathy. now kill yourself, please.
>>

 No.118392

>>118383
> is not helping in the slightest.
Why is the onus on me to perform emotional labor for a mentally ill stranger?
>>

 No.118395

>>118389
>had
he's not dead and he hasn't abandoned them. idiotic use of the past perfect tense
>>

 No.118402

>>118389
>i would be lik u but u anoyed me so now im ur enemy
>u pushed for comunism to hard, now i hate it
>>

 No.118403

File: 1627576492642.png ( 108.22 KB , 1085x554 , ClipboardImage.png )

>>118376
>And how do you know that the suicide rates are due to society not being understanding enough rather than being due to mental illness?
I'm sure the concept comes out of nowhere..
>>

 No.118405

>>118395
*has
i wont make such an egregious error again commisar, please dont send me to the gulag
>>118402
if commies were as retarded as transphobes and troons then yes absolutely
>>

 No.118407

>>118405
>muh both sides
>ur a troon btw
Vast majority of people who support trans rights are cis themselves.
Here's a revelation that might blow your mind:
Being a good person doesn't require one to have a material interest in convincing everyone else to be good. It's even possible for a person to advocate for things like worker rights when one is clearly a bourg!
>>

 No.118441

>>118407
>Vast majority of people who support trans rights are cis themselves.

not transgender but considered the idea in an FTM way before so could probably say i get it better than most people
>>

 No.118442

>>118403
Please tell me how this is different from saying it’s society’s fault that they just don’t accept that the wall people are real and that’s why schizophrenics commit suicide?
>>

 No.118444

>>118407
Why does doing emotional labor for histrionic strangers have anything to do with whether or not I am a good person?
>>

 No.118445

File: 1627578638728.jpg ( 45.4 KB , 720x872 , O52FWkJh.jpg )


>emotional labor
>>

 No.118446

>>118442
>>118444
>how is thing different from completely different thing? also stop making me expend emotional labor bro :^)
>>

 No.118448

the twelve emotional labours of hercul–
ah fuck the new yorker beat me to it
>>

 No.118450

Other people existing is heavy emotional labor.
GIBS NOW!

I'm hateful and bitter, so it's even harder labor. Having to bear existence of those different from me or even similar to me.

Under communism, anyone who isn't completely like me, will be gulag'd for bourg degeneracy.
>>

 No.118452

>>118450
*follows you*
>>

 No.118458

>>118446
>Thinking you are the opposite sex to the point of suicide ideation is actually very different from thinking demons live in the corners of the rooms
Okay now tell me how this is different from telling me I need to cater to someone with BPD or else they will kill themselves

Literally why should the emotional well being of a total stranger concern me or have anything to do with my moral standing lmao
>>118450
>Dude, like, if you don’t validate me you literally want to KILL ME because I will kill myself if you don’t validate me
Emotional manipulation eh?
Does this work on anyone other than liberals and close relatives/friends though?
>>

 No.118460

>>118452
Stop with your idpol!
>>

 No.118461

why does it always come back to BPD
>>

 No.118462

>>118458
>Okay now tell me how this is different from telling me I need to cater to someone with BPD or else they will kill themselves

i mean you just ignored stats showing you one of these approaches works for a certain condition, can you show me stats showing this approach works for bpd or schizophrenia??
>>

 No.118463

>>118461
Oh shit, I just realized that he's the BPD females poster.
Shame, I though BPD poster was a memer rather than a retard.
>>

 No.118465

File: 1627579410885.png ( 598.35 KB , 761x543 , ClipboardImage.png )

>>118461
because the heckin bpd hoes are ruining everything anon believe me
>>

 No.118466

>>118461
Because that’s another disorder centering around emotional dysregulation and delusional thoughts in which sufferers move towards self-harm and suicidal actions in response to personal slights
>>118462
I don’t really give the fuck about the stats, what confuses me is why I need to personally validate people I do not know nor particularly care about and what this has to do with my moral standing

And has literally anyone ever tried the approach of validating schizophrenics and BPD sufferers in their beliefs? I’m quite certain that gender dysphoria is the only mental illness where the premium is on validating the sufferer that all of their beliefs are completely correct
>>118463
Wrong, I mentioned BPD for the reasons stated above in this comment
>>

 No.118468

>>118466
>I don’t really give the fuck about the stats
they are relevant to your comparison between these different conditions and why therapists will tend to treat them differently.
>>

 No.118469

>>118466
>Wrong, I mentioned BPD for the reasons stated above in this comment
Nice, looks like "BPD females" poster is not necessarily a retard.
>>

 No.118471

>>118461
Imageboard retards need new satanic panics and iterate through them.
>Muh trans
>Muh bpd
>Muh degeneracy
>Muh poly relationships
>Muh lazyness is bad, work will set us free
>Muh "real" working class
>Muh PMC
>Muh NFC
>Muh NPC
>Muh CPC
>Muh Long Beach Island Californication (LBC)
Summertime, and the shitposting's easy
Incel's on the microphone with PMCs.​
All people in the thread will agree that we're well-qualified to represent the CPC. And me and Louie, we gon' run to the communist party, dance to the rhythm, it gets harder…
>>

 No.118472

>>118468
As I said before
Gender dysphoria is the only condition where the “solution” is to say the sufferers beliefs are entirely correct and then get everyone around them to also say they are correct
Maybe the suicide rates of schizophrenics would be lower if we told them there really is a cabal of satanic lizard men who run the world and monitor them constantly and that they truly can hear other people’s thoughts, but for obvious reasons no doctor does this.
>>

 No.118473

>>118471
>>Muh Long Beach Island Californication (LBC)
i want to hear about this one, the rest sound boring
>>

 No.118474

>>118472
>Gender dysphoria is the only condition where the “solution” is to say the sufferers beliefs are entirely correct
what about autism? autistic people tend to be less likely to conform to social standards just for the sake of it, do you want to force them to conform instead of telling them it's ok to hold that view??
>>

 No.118475

>>118472
>retard tries into psychology
>provides zero evidence
>contradicts known facts
>haha but what if we told schizos that they are right xD
>>

 No.118481

>>118465
wtf, dogisaga is based again?
>>

 No.118482

>>118473
The ENTIRE WORLD is adopting California's aesthetic.
>Long boards
>Hippie shit
>Adding "uh" to the end of exclamations
<Oh my God-uuuh!
<Why did you do it-uhh!
>Identity politics
>Quinoa™ lifestyle
>Festivals a là Coachella
The ENTIRE WORLD is becoming California. As leftists, we really need to focus on this phenomenon and urgently address it.
>>

 No.118487

>>118482
I bet the Irish are behind this
>>

 No.118488

File: 1627580334388.png ( 5.28 KB , 266x130 , ClipboardImage.png )

>>118481
she told me that she's embracing her 1/10th abbo ancestry or something, it kind of seems to me like she's adopted some kind of schizo ideology now due to being a bit alienated from the right-wing lately
no idea what the deal is

>>118482
kind of funny
>>

 No.118489

>>118474
Lmao
Pretty sure autists with friends are less likely to kill themselves than autists without them
And autists also don’t hold delusional beliefs about reality, which is why I mentioned disorders centering around that, schizophrenia as a really far off one consisting of hallucinations, and then BPD which I would say is honestly closer to reality than gender dysphoria since, by comparisons, borderlines are usually just fearing loss and magnifying personal slights out of proportion.
>>118475
Bro, can I ask why I would give a fuck about what politically motivated “facts” American Psychology shits out? If these people can say that you can psychologically be the opposite sex even though sex is a biological feature while denying transracialism exists (considering race is not real by comparison) then honestly I don’t give a fuck what they have to say.
They also used to lock up schizophrenics in basically torture facilities and do electroshock therapy, but yeah I’m sure they’re completely trustworthy in the modern day when they fuck with the hormones of healthy bodies and even go as far as mutilating and sterilizing people lmao
>>

 No.118491

>>118488
>being a bit alienated from the right-wing lately
What?
>>

 No.118494

>>118482
this is actually true (and a problem) though
i blame the fact that silicon valley tech cunts took over the world and, to a lesser degree, holywood. i pray each day before bedtime that The Big One arrives and eats up silicon valley.

>>118488
good news if true, hope she's doing well.
>>

 No.118495

>>118489
>Pretty sure autists with friends are less likely to kill themselves than autists without them
there's a difference between having friends who accept you for you and friends who accept the fake self you constructed for them… the former is much more satisfying
no idea what you're saying about which conditions to compare with which, i dont know if you understand these conditions but i probably see it differently because i've read a decent amount of the medical literature
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1d9KKqP9IHa5ZxU84a_Jf0vIoAh7e8nj_lCW27KbYBh0/edit#gid=1074721744
this is basically "every paper on transsexualism to exist fucking ever" but if you're legitimately interested in the condition i have it on the backburner to go through a lot of this stuff as someone maybe interested in becoming a psychologist or some such
i recommend the sci-hub.se domain for accessing papers rather than the .tw domain though since i think that domain broke recently

>>118491
she was talking about being alienated by hypocrisy, such as criminal activity being ok when a white rightwinger does it but not when it's a black guy basically, she brought up george floyd i guess

i can kind of relate to her in a mirrored fashion because i've been somewhat alienated from the left recently and become more schizo ideologically over it i guess

though as you can see from the above… im not a right-winger culture warrior at all.
>>

 No.118497

>>118494
>i pray each day before bedtime that The Big One arrives and eats up silicon valley.
Ftaghn, brother!

>>118495
>she was talking about being alienated by hypocrisy, such as criminal activity being ok when a white rightwinger does it but not when it's a black guy basically, she brought up george floyd i guess
Hope that she revises her worldview, not just the shit that was immediately contradictory.
I've been memed into alt-right memes as well, but once I started fact checking, I revised my views not just on le holohoax, but also on unrelated shit, like transgender rights and discrimination of nogs.
/pol/ is always wrong.
>>

 No.118498

>>118334
no they view it as a product of of a profit motivated system not caring whether or not its worker/consumers are able to fit into a gender role. Thus making a culture for profit over this ability. With the average citizen not being able to fit into what they feel their gender role is and with the most extreme cases mutilating their body to try and fit into another gender. And that is assuming it is only a passive process, it is not.

liberal rightoids view it as weak degenerates, either biologically or behaviorally, unable to cope with life and instead falling into their natural place, thus justifying the liberals perceived superiority over them.

Alt Rightiods view it as a Jewish backed subversion of gender roles to weaken the white race. And thus strengthen their own position of relative power and safety.
>>

 No.118502

>>118498
>no they view it as a product of of a profit motivated system not caring whether or not its worker/consumers are able to fit into a gender role.
This ignores the materialist reality of the benefits that transition provides.
>>

 No.118504

>>118502
i would say it more ignores the reality of the origins of the condition, you can see on the spreadsheets i posted >>118495 the overlaps to intersex conditions, genetics, autism, etc. there is even a section for twin/sibling studies on the document
>>

 No.118508

>>118502
care to explain what you mean. Are you referring to the benefits of the average fully gender transition giving some $200,000 to various doctors and pharmaceuticals? Are are you say thing from the perspective of the man or women transitioning, that they are able to better themselves in a materialist perspective after their transition?
>>

 No.118509

>>118502
>He genuinely thinks you can just plug the word “materialist” in as a means to justify dogshit Mengele tier liberal eugenicist psychology
>>

 No.118513

>>118462
Being nice and materially supporting depressed trans people helps them, which proves they are dealing with real shit, but does it work for other depressed people? – No, only trans people have real and valid depression, with other people you have to kick them in the shins.
>>118474
>what about autism?
We tell them they are trans.
>>

 No.118515

>>118504
I can't read 4000 paper right now could you perhaps be condense your point
>>

 No.118517

>>118508
Social benefits of lower suicidality, depression, HIV infection rate and so on.
Mostly for the person transitioning, but not just for them.
>average fully gender transition
>average fully
Misleading
Average transition is 20k, not 200k.
Here's a good meta analysis:
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs11606-015-3529-6

Unless you disagree with things I take for granted, like
>healthy, productive people dying is not a good thing
>HIV infection is not a good thing
>loss of labor due to depression is not a good thing
>>

 No.118519

>>118515
the TL;DR is that it is demonstrated to have a seriously genetic and/or in-born component so it's not accurate to say it's something resulting directly from a profit system

like here is an example paper from the sibling studies section

>Transsexuality Among Twins: Identity Concordance, Transition, Rearing, and Orientation
http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2010to2014/2013-transsexuality.html

>Combining data from our independent findings with those from past research, 13 of 39 male MZ twin pairs (33.3%) were found to be concordant for transsexual identity and eight of 25 (22.8%) female MZ twins were found concordant. In comparison, concordance between either male or female DZ twins was low or zero (1/38 = 2.6%; Table 5).
>>

 No.118543

>>118517
it is completely adjacent to the point I am making, that the system, itself, is the cause of these issues that must be addressed. Not whether the coping mechanisms help or not.

>Average transition is 20k, not 200k.
I was including a FULL Mtf transition across a lifetime meaning lifetime proscription to hormones' and including sexual reassignment surgery, breast augmentation ect. The paper you linked both not taking into account the market rate for these surgeries for each patient to get ALL of these surgeries in a full transition. Not just certain ones. I would like to add their end conclusions for effectiveness are made by subtracting hypothetical costs of other conditions. I hate to add this but the use statistical buzzwords in this paper were bit to much
>>

 No.118544

>>118519
>seriously genetic and/or in-born component
ok so what is the component, how do we test for it before any gender transitions?
>>

 No.118545

>>118543
You're implying that we have to condemn the whole treatment on the basis that a small subset of possible implementations is very costly.
Then you want to discard the benefits.

>the system, itself, is the cause of these issues that must be addressed
I have shown evidence, now it's your turn.
I won't demand ultra-high quality or irrationally strict criteria, like requiring the "smoking gun" evidence that people were killing themselves over lack of SRS long before literacy was common, which was requested above.
But I can't work with just claims and this is what you offered so far.
>>

 No.118546

Just show potential transsexuals pictures of the axe wounds and they will just turn into femboys in no time.
>>

 No.118551

>>118546
Most trans women never get SRS, /pol/ack.
You're also forgetting that 40% of people who don't identify as their assigned sex have been assigned female. And those who get genital surgery are a tiny minority here.
>>

 No.118556

>>118551
>/pol/lack
I fully support full body conversions into dolphins unironically. Transsexuals come off as sissies because they don't want to go full freak IMO.
>>

 No.118559

>Premise 1: Trans people are overwhelmingly workers (exploited above the average rate, which will be discussed later)

>Premise 2: Communists fight for the workers

>Conclusion: Communists fight with/for trans people
>>

 No.118560

>Premise 1: Furries are overwhelmingly workers (exploited above the average rate, which will be discussed later)

>Premise 2: Communists fight for the workers

>Conclusion: Communists fight with/for furries
>>

 No.118562

>Workers rights is when people accept my fetish
>>

 No.118565

>>118545
I think you are misunderstanding my point. I am only referencing the cost as to show the profit motive for those involved. Not whether or not the treatment is beneficial to the persons involved.

>I have shown evidence
evidence of what? What does your paid study show?
>evidence
Looking for a ban excuse are we? here's a paper correlating transgenderism and poverty, though that's not really the point DOI: 10.1089/trgh.2018.0024

It's not called claims, it called theory. If you want to study it more I recommend anything by Antonio Gramsci. We cannot test these theories but by our own societies.

For example, those of light skin made up the ruling class of many colonial societies, they came up with a idea that this white skin made them superior to their subjects because of this. The culture of what the ruling class can enjoy gets projected onto he working class.

>>118544
this will obviously never be answered as those unfortunate souls are well aware that their condition is not innate, but they are forced to fight for the little hippieness they think they can achieve as individuals in their position. Tragic situation
>>

 No.118578

>>117962
Cockshott is a socialist who argues for socialists economics, that's why they are trying to cancel him. It's just that they are not able to attack his economic arguments so they look for other excuses to attack him. He hasn't said anything discriminatory. He wrote a few articles where he disagrees with the theories of certain academics, that is a legitimate thing to do. Theories are not people. There are no victims here, other than intellectual honesty.
>>

 No.118591

>>117962
>Nowhere in this argument does a need arise for philosophizing about sex or gender. (Nor analyzing Google word analytics, as Cockshott does.)

does he fucking really
what a god damn nerd
>>

 No.118593

>>118544
>ok so what is the component, how do we test for it before any gender transitions?
>>118565
>this will obviously never be answered

Holy shit, you could at least pretend you've read the papers I am linking you which detail this very thing. It's very obvious you're not seriously interested in what I am telling you.
https://www.newsweek.com/transgender-people-gender-dysphoria-gene-variants-study-1486270
Here, a news article. That should be more your speed.
>>

 No.118597

Reminder that cross dressing fetishists are not part of the proletariat and will be among the first in front of a firing squad, provided they’re not lynched years beforehand once people get sick of them
>>

 No.118608

Reminder hat 4chan weirdos are not part of the proletariat and will be among the first in front of a firing squad, provided they're not lynched when I leak the NSA's logs that tie posts to real identities.
>>

 No.118609

File: 1627590013311.png ( 1.78 MB , 699x1092 , working class5.PNG )

>>118593
ok so we test for these gene variants before any hormones or treatment surgery is done. Although that is obviously not done because the vast majority would just be products of their circumstance rather than of some strange gene

instead a eunuch class, originating fromm the literally meaning of those that are good to their masters, is created. and those unsatisfied males who make up the bulwark or any change are literally castrated.

Is that what communism does, it says the meek shall inherit the earth and holds up an idea of a pathetic and degenerate working class while no material changes happen til the after life. And capitalism instead, holds up the visage of a working class deserving of equality? No they project a weak and undeserving working class, innately, that is the cultural war
>>

 No.118611

>In an incredible twist of fate, Cockshott has adopted Butler’s viewpoint that gender is a “performance” put on by trans people – the only difference is Butler extends this principle to cis people, whereas Cockshott uses it as an excuse to dismiss the existence of trans people as a “distraction.” (Frankly, I find the existence of British people an irritating distraction, but I have the sense to not elevate my own prejudice to the level of dogma and demand others conform to it!)

lol wrecked
>>

 No.118615

under communism, everyone will be like the people i like, and nobody will be like the people i don't like, they will all be killed in the revolution, and i will enjoy that. if a situation should arise that makes me uncomfortable, such as someone having an eye disease, then in the first instance socialist medicine will abolish eye disease, and in the second, they're probably doing it on purpose. they don't really have a disease, they have capitalist eyes, they must be killed. kill kill kill kill kill kill. they're dead? right, give me 5 minutes until my eyes stop feeling goey, then we'll sit down and watch my favourite film, which will be everyone's favourite film, because all of the people who don't appreciate its cinematic genius have met with an unfortunate end.
i am very normal.
>>

 No.118619

>>118615
who is talking about killing anyone
>>

 No.118620

>>118619
me.
>>

 No.118621

under communism, the only person who will be killed is socdem poster. everyone else will live in a post-scarcity scientific utopia. sneed.
>>

 No.118622

>In the same work, Cockshott alleges that, “The labour of birth is, in reality, the foundation of all other production.” Putting aside the question of the chicken and the egg, why draw the line at birth? The birth cannot happen without sexual intercourse, which cannot occur without at least one willing person—is the biological sex drive the foundation of all other production, as Freud theorized? I could just as easily say that the production of the Sun’s radiation is, in reality, the foundation of all other production, and be equally correct. Without food production, no pregnancy can be carried to term. There are an infinite number of preconditions necessary for production to take place. Arbitrarily selecting one of them and declaring it the foundation of all production is shoddy materialism and un-dialectical.
>>

 No.118623

>>118621
Cope and sneed. Socdem poster is one of the best on this site, especially compared to all the /pol/yp "converts"
>>

 No.118627

>>118623
imagine thinking your ideology was some sort of club people join or convert to
>>

 No.118629

>>118621
see you could've done something with this concept, you could've crafted an insulting description of a hobgoblin being chased down by foxhunters before the foxhunters themselves are executed for being bourgeois, you could've written all of this stuff, increasingly specific in your imagery, perhaps at the very end saying it's me. but you didn't, you did nothing interesting with it. you've just said "you will be killed" - wow. i'll be killed? really? gosh.

anyway for those of you at the back who were drawing:
you see, the point of post 118615 isn't the killing, it's the pathological desire to bend reality to fit a vision that makes you most comfortable. the killing is merely there for the image it creates of the kind of person who has such fantasies, the real meat of the thing is the "as if by magic, we cure eye disease". you're supposed to imagine a guy who feels uneasy when eye diseases are discussed, because that's a pretty common thing, you may even feel that way yourself: and then you're think, what if, instead of dealing with this as the normal consequence of having eyes, someone tried to make sure they'd never feel that way again? and then you can tie all that back together and go: ah, i see, this is one of them analogies, like they do in far fewer words. then in 3 posts time you can go ah, this is one of them self-indulgent explanations, a bit you fucking stole you thieving cunt. you, you will be killed socdem poster, you personally, by me, despite sharing my taste in films.

i am very normal.
>>

 No.118632

>>118623
She thinks a gameover scenario for the proletariat is elon musk going to mars
>>

 No.118633

>>118551
>Most trans women never get SRS
Is that for lack of ability or lack of wanting? If it is for lack of ability then >>118545 is wrong about low-balling the costs. If it is for lack of wanting how does this fit together with claiming gender dysphoria? Isn't it a more plausible description that an mtf who seeks men and doesn't want bottom surgery is a self-loathing homosexual?

>>118578
OP's article literally states that the author would be delighted by the economic views of Cockshott, but alas, since his trans views are haram, his economic writings are not useful after all, see >>118033
>>

 No.118638

>>118627
This is what happens with liberal "converts".
>>

 No.118645

>>118407
>>muh both sides
fuck your "both sides" bullshit you stupid fucking piece of shit. all i've done is pointed out the fact that both twitter troons and transphobes are absolutely fucking insane moronic cunts. i don't give a fuck about "sides", this isn't the fucking sandbox in the playground during lunch break you nitwit. the worst you can accuse me of doing is stating the obvious.
everything else in your post is drivel that has no relation to what i give a shit about. i don't want to be a "good person", i don't give a fuck if people are "good" or not. do you think i follow marxists because they're the "good guys"? do you think we're living in some sort of capeshit movie???
i don't give a fuck about trans issues anymore because it's become nothing more than a distraction. this is a topic that effects a fraction of a fraction of the population and yet it manages to pop up in every remotely left-wing political circle. it's pure ideological manipulation at this point and all of us are guilty of it. fuck this shit, and fuck you too, for no reason in particular i'm just angry tbh but still fuck you.

>>118623
wrong. next to zizek flagfag, socdem flagfag is the second worst poster on the entire site. cope seethe and dilate but don't have sex.
>>

 No.118647

>>118623
you definitely deserve each other with your shit takes
>>

 No.118649

>>118623
you really rattled their cages with this one huh
>>

 No.118651

>>118645
Based post. Agree 100% except that broscialist flag is at the same level of terrible posts than Zizek flag.
>>

 No.118653

>>118651
i can agree to this stipulation. most flagfags are midwits at best either way.
>>

 No.118655

>>118633
this 0.5% of the population is being pushed as a wedge into socialist politics. There are no socialists that think that unwed males between the ages of 20-40, the main demographics of those dissatisfied with the status qou and willing to act, should instead castrate themselves to solve their problems. ANDOR that secretly trans people control the media.

Anyone pushing LBGTQ is either a subversive or someone so far subversed they no longer feel the ethical dilemma to push this on their own people.
>>

 No.118657

>>118655
hi /pol/
>>

 No.118660

Just delete the thread
>>

 No.118661

>>118562
Yea this shit is annoying af, holy fuck
Imagine saying
>BE NICE TO ME OR I WILL KILL MYSELF
And then talking about armed revolution moments later lmao
>>

 No.118662

>>118657
die
>>

 No.118664

>>118657
>/pol/
Figures the anarkid is so mind-warped that it believes if you don’t support some stupid liberal idpol centering basically language, culture, and modes of thought you must be a “polack”
Maybe you are just a lost twitterite?
Isn’t there anything at all of value for anarchists to fight over instead of identity politics centering around less than 1% of Anglodom much less the rest of humanity?
>>

 No.118665

>>118655
>Anyone pushing LBGTQ is either a subversive or someone so far subversed they no longer feel the ethical dilemma to push this on their own people.
okay. anyone at all "pushing" LGBTQ, including any LGBTQ people themselves as well as their straight friends and family, i'm guessing? okay, no problem at all. all we have to do is make a special law that makes "pushing LGBTQ" a criminal pffense and then start arresting. sound good to you? frankly it thrills me, we're gonna bang so much in prison anyway
>>

 No.118671

>>118651
You’re just angry that I’m not some woke radlib faggot masquerading as an “anti-idpol leftist” while still seething at people that won’t “accept” [X] LBGT culture idpol medical association etc etc etc
>>

 No.118674

Aimee Terese won't fuck you bro she's not real
>>

 No.118677

File: 1627593522571.png ( 424.51 KB , 460x453 , ClipboardImage.png )

>>118609
can you inform me on when the last time you touched some grass was? i am curious thanks
>>

 No.118678

>>118671
>Your just angry … [stopped reading here]
We do not care.
〜(꒪꒳꒪)〜
ヾ( ͝° ͜ʖ͡°)ノ♪
>>

 No.118680

>>118674
Aimee Terese looks like a junkie
>>

 No.118681

>>118609
Based
Getting annoying how Anglo leftism is literally
>Yea we just need to get all the mentally and materially most fucked up people and they will be the revolution no matter how small that number is and how alienated it is from everyone else lol
Like what fam?
I’d rather recruit gangsters, goddamn, at least they got the hardened hearts of criminals
>>

 No.118683

Darlin', in your wildest dreams, you never had a clue
But it's time you got the news
I'm gonna harden my heart
>>

 No.118687

>>118622
based
>>

 No.118692

>>118665
its terrible isn't it. The ideology infects those around you. Those people who just want a better life or want their family members to be happy. They are now consumed by this ideology.

Lenin stated his ideology was against Christianity and Alcohol. Something almost all of the Russian people either enjoyed or had family enjoy. But 0.5% of the populations fetishes are apparently to much of divider, no need to ignore any cultural analysis here, everything is innate.

Give up your nation, your god, your race, your ethnicity ect. But the men wearing dresses are critical to the revolutionary spirit, their identity must be validated. Anyone pushing this is an obvious subversive, the only real question is how did it ever get this bad. I have my own theories, but did they ever know it would really spread the the greater part of society when they did it.
>>

 No.118695

>>118692
It only is prevalent in Anglo society, and even then more specifically the Anglo left
As to why the Anglo left let themselves be completely duped and manipulated by this current level of the liberal discourse? Well, Anglo left is really fucking deep into idpol of all types anyway, just look at what libs did during BLM, have whites kneel and beg for forgiveness lmao
>>

 No.118699

Aimee👏Terese👏won't👏fuck👏you👏bro👏she's👏not👏real
>>

 No.118723

>>118681
>I’d rather recruit gangsters
oh sorry, thought your sort considered them irredeemable "lumpenprole scum", that seems up your alley
>>

 No.118746

>>118695
I can't believe this to be fully organic. Certainly the idea leaders, college educated Marxists, were very easily swayed to other ideologies that kept them in the revolutionary group, fighting any oppression. But that this was entirely of their own doing and not pushed along by interested groups seems too be to much. Especially when you point out it is localized in the anglosphere.
>>

 No.118750

>>118695
>anti trans but would rather ride with the lumpen
Shut the fuck up you pseud.
>>

 No.118827

>>118723
Nope, they can at least be fighters which beats being emotional wrecks
>>118746
I do not think it is organic, this particular shibboleth seemingly began in academia
>>118750
I’d rather lumpen who could at least fight and keep their shit together in a life-and-death situation over lumpen that can’t even do THAT
>>

 No.118830

>>118750
Lol. I know a couple of trans who are in the SRA. I would love to see them shove a gun down your throat.
>>

 No.118832

File: 1627601419633.jpg ( 180.76 KB , 1000x1000 , Read a Fucking Book.jpg )

>>117963
Read a Fucking Book
>>

 No.118840

>>118338
>if there is no data its not real

I wonder if there is some kind of monetary incentive to study some things and not others. Really makes u thinky dink.
>>

 No.118841

>>118369
People have been eating certain plants drinking horse piss and using mechanical devices to change their gender expression for tens of thousands of years.

Your logic would lead to autism and depression also not existing before we could detect it.
>>

 No.118846

>>118458
>cater
>>118444
>histrionic
>>118442
>society’s fault
>>118392
>emotional labor

you have to go back
>>

 No.118850

>>118472
>but for obvious reasons no doctor does this
Actually they do, and it works + has better outcomes.
You would actually have a case if you were arguing this from a Schizoanalytic perspective like Guitarri or anti-psychiatry like Szasz instead of reactionary idpol.
>>

 No.118854

>>118846
Fuck you problematic bigot. You are a traitor to radical feminism and there is nothing wrong with crticizing your attempt to force me into performing emotional labor for your privileged self. Small penis incel
>>

 No.118858

>>118392
Lmao not being an intentional piece of shit to people is emotional labour now
>>

 No.118860

>>118854
lol u are so mad
>>

 No.118866

>>118854
Radical feminism is literally the most anti Marxist academic ideology around - it states that women are in a super special class adjacent to capitalist exploitation because of their nature - there are of course ways to examine feminism from a Marxist viewpoint just as there are ways for race issues but the moon wolf goddess shit clearly isn't it
>>

 No.118869

>>118010
lol cope and ad hom
where is the argument?
>>

 No.118871

>>118854
Literally not even me, you people get so absurdly defensive over tr**nies, I don’t understand it and never will. It’s like Anglospherans get so…enraged…when someone states they are a communist but won’t fly the LGBT flag with them
>>118846
Oh no, not mean words
I need to give up them sweet sweet validation tokens or else I am le evil polyp
Yea you 100% are not at all a radlib having a hissy fit that someone would be a communist without being brainwashed by angloism
>>118830
Mentally ill cope, nobody cares about that LARP club
I don’t think obese rightoid boomers would be useful to the right in an actual SHTF scenario, why would the fucking socialist equivalent of them be useful?
>>118858
>Bro if you don’t cater to the emotions of a grown ass adult you are a piece of shit bro
I activate my reverse card, now you are the piece of shit for expecting me to care about the emotional well-being of people I do not even know
>>

 No.118872

It amuses me when western feminists fail to get women into power while even succdem nations such as China and or even reactinoary places like Iraq/Iran or just regular ol ml places like Cuba have much more women in their seats of government AND also have more women working in scientific jobs.
>>

 No.118873

>>118872
Western feminists DID get women into power, it just means absolutely nothing to have female porkies oppressing you alongside male porkies
>>

 No.118876

>>118872
because it's 100% pure liberal cope and is completely detached from reality, nobody who actually gives a shit about women's place in society acts as retarded as western feminists do
>>

 No.118877

>>118871
>I don’t think obese rightoid boomers would be useful to the right in an actual SHTF scenario, why would the fucking socialist equivalent of them be useful?
it may be possible, and i know it's a crazy consideration, but it may be possible that the socialist version takes a different approach from right-wing larping schizo boomers
>>

 No.118878

>>118871
Again no one has ever defined emotional labour as being humane to others, this is like saying not calling black people a uyghur is an act of emotional labour. Please fuck off
>>

 No.118879

I propose for the rest of this thread we laugh at the butthurt brocialism poster for managing to out retard everyone else
>>

 No.118881

>>118873
even then only 30% of those who are in power are women while Cuba is like what 55% of that who have power are women?
>>118876
Of course, yet they always ignore it when I bring it up to them. It's like their hysterical bullshit is a trap made by male porkies meant to enslave women kind.
>>

 No.118882

File: 1627602793649.jpg ( 117.17 KB , 1206x880 , anglo_box (2).jpg )

>>118681
>>118681
>>

 No.118884

>>118881
>Of course, yet they always ignore it when I bring it up to them. It's like their hysterical bullshit is a trap made by male porkies meant to enslave women kind.
No, it's because it's cope. Telling them that it's cope wont make them stop coping. This is the consequence of capitalist realist brainrot, they can't find any other solution to their problems but cope and taking it away from them is liking taking away an alcoholic's booze.
>>

 No.118887

>>118871
It has nothing to do with the words being mean it betrays your ideology as deeply reactionary. You are basically holding up a big neon sign that says "I have no idea what I'm talking about". Why don't you go start a thread about how cultural marxist postmodernism is destroying the left.
>>

 No.118888

>>118884
you're right it is a cope.
>>

 No.118894

>>118877
> it may be possible, and i know it's a crazy consideration, but it may be possible that the socialist version takes a different approach from right-wing larping schizo boomers
Yea, the difference is that SRA is just a club AFAIK which I respect more than prepper LARP
>>118878
Explain how these things are equivalent
The problem with the liberal brainwashing attempt is that liberals do not go so far as claiming I merely need to be polite to trans people
No, I must also participate in the charade and genuinely convince myself that in fact a person truly can be the opposite sex from what they biologically are because…uh…well see males and females have different brains and sometimes you can have a male body with the female brain!

Being polite and courteous is something I do with everyone, demanding I embrace someone else’s…less than sane positions is something else entirely.
>>118879
I am only butthurt that the Left in my part of the world is led by the nose by liberals and will likely never hold any amount of power and influence until the world simply collapses and the violent take power, which may well not be leftists anyway and probably won’t be
But I know deep down all of you are perfectly fine with the Left being totally irrelevant so long as you can enjoy it as a subculture that pushes out those dastardly normies
>>118887
My ideology is deeply reactionary because I don’t play the liberal identity game you lot enjoy? Because I don’t care much about the emotional well-being of other adults? Because I won’t allow myself to be manipulated by grown adults who I do not even know threatening to end their lives for some cultural shibboleth?
> Why don't you go start a thread about how cultural marxist postmodernism is destroying the left.
Because unlike you braindead radlibs that will make threads defecating on accomplished and highly intelligent Marxist theorists I am not obsessed to culture to this degree

Why does it anger you so much that I cannot be bent in this way?
>>

 No.118897

>>118894
Stop moving the goalpost because you are retarded you defined emotional labour as intentionally being shitty to trans people - this is no different than calling every woman you meet a fucking slut because to say different would hurt your own feelings
>>

 No.118905

>>118897
>trans people
this doesn't exist anymore than poor people exist
>>

 No.118906

>>118894
>I HATE LIBERALS
>Why does it anger you so much that I cannot be bent in this way?
I am so unique. Please listen to what I have to say.
>>

 No.118908

>>118897
I never moved the goalpost nor even stated what defines emotional labor, that’s something you liberals chose to do yourselves. You likely have an idea of what I mean but would rather shit yourself with rage at the notion that, no, all I owe trans people is to personally let them be, but actually giving validation, actually giving 100% enthusiastic support? No, I do not at all have to do these things, should not be expected to, and will not be guilted or threatened into doing so.

I find it quite curious how this utter non-issue animates you people as opposed to the issue of racial oppression which you view as quite the non-issue only brought up to “divide” the workers despite the repulsively violent history of colonialism and racial suppression and the frequently much more deadly and materially depriving consequences of it by comparison
>>118906
I am effectively responding to the attacks on a genuinely useful Marxist theorist such as Cockshott simply because Anglo leftists shake and shudder the second someone won’t bend the knee to the LGBT-academic shibboleth
>>

 No.118911

>>118908
> I don't move the goalpost
< Eat shit colonialist scum
Take an iq test whenever I'm done
>>

 No.118914

>>118911
Never said anything about you being a colonialist scum, I just find it funny how leftypol gets so seething and enraged in support of trans identity politics while being largely dismissive over issues like racial discrimination and racial oppression
>>

 No.118916

>>118908
Also I can name like three blogs with better analysis than dickblast, like I said earlier he's a good introduction to some of the material just like Wolf or Chomsky is for centrists turning succdem - but this site idolizes his mediocrity
>>

 No.118917

>>118916
Lmao then go ahead and name them
If the writer has a Picrew Avatar I will immediately discard whatever they have to say
>>

 No.118922

>>118917
Jehu, critique of crisis theory, the next recession
Also in order of how much I like them
Harry cleaver (not a blogger) also has an excellent site covering Marxs works and making it tie in to modern day struggles
>>

 No.118924

>>118922
None of them are leninists so you may be lost in a world that isn't obsessed with archaic political action
>>

 No.118935

>>118894
Mr Peterson, could you show us on the doll where the essjew radlibs took over your tongue and made you say no-no words? Would you prefer us to embrace your delusion or refute it?
>>

 No.118939

File: 1627605437081.png ( 230.29 KB , 576x430 , ClipboardImage.png )

>>118908
>>

 No.118942

>>118908
>You likely have an idea of what I mean
No one does because you are making shit up in your head. Maybe you should define your terms instead of spamming buzzwords, but then people would be able to call out your bullshit.
>>

 No.118946

>>118629
>see you could've done something with this concept, you could've crafted an insulting description of a hobgoblin being chased down by foxhunters before the foxhunters themselves are executed for being bourgeois, you could've written all of this stuff, increasingly specific in your imagery, perhaps at the very end saying it's me. but you didn't, you did nothing interesting with it. you've just said "you will be killed" - wow. i'll be killed? really? gosh.
this might shock your hyper-inflated ego but you'll never be worth putting that much effort into
>>

 No.118954

>>118946
you wouldn't be doing it for me, idiot. not content with being a polycule that doesn't know how to write, you've now branched out into not knowing why you should write either.
>>

 No.118958

The left will defend mentally ill coomers before they defend the actual working class.
>>

 No.118961

>>118954
projection, seethe
>>

 No.118966

>>118958
Ah yes the exploited class of previously tenured professors.
>>

 No.118968

i can't imagine having this much of a hissy fit over men in dresses. Even if you hate them who gives a shit. This is so boring. Unironically.
>>

 No.118969

>>118966
worst poster
>>

 No.118971

File: 1627607077502.png ( 237.65 KB , 449x576 , Precious cinnamon roll tha….png )

>>118958
Because as Lenin famously stated, "the proletariat is defined by those who are cis gender conforming heterosexuals"
>>

 No.118975

>>118922
>Jehu
Kek he's definitely a more shallow Marxist than Cockshott. He got roasted last year in a thread on Bunker where he went himself and sperged out. (He thought he was quoting Marx when he actually quoted an insertion by the editors marked as such by the formatting – which is something that you know if you read the book from the beginning; meaning he did just ctrl-f instead.) At least he's not Muke.
>>

 No.118976

>>118971
I mean, he was a good reflector of material conditions. If he didn't state that, it's likely most are.
>>

 No.118979

>>118975
Anyone who reads his blog knows he's read Marx pretty extensively. Literally every single post of his is refuting other marxists with direct quotes from Marx and sometimes Engels. Also whenever he goes on this board he typically asks a poignant question and then gets flamed and ignored, his last post probably being the most trenchant question of the covid pandemic.

If one tenth of the posters were near the level of Jehu's study of Marx this site would be a lot more honest
>>

 No.118996

File: 1627608935609.gif ( 30.42 KB , 516x290 , when you see someone post ….gif )

>>118979
>Also whenever he goes on this board he typically asks a poignant question and then gets flamed and ignored, his last post probably being the most trenchant question of the covid pandemic.
>>

 No.119016

>>118996
Question was the nature of labour organizing in a post covid world. Entire board ignored it and said there was no issue lol.

But we gotta 500+ post on leftypol when a nazi wants to be 'reformed'
>>

 No.119020

File: 1627610576031.jpg ( 9.67 KB , 300x100 , whispers something about c….jpg )

>>119016
If the entire board ignored it, how come you remember it?
>>

 No.119027

>>119020
And this is what I mean when I say most communists are incredibly dishonest people.
>>

 No.119032

I'll be honest, the first thread I saw with her name was full of garbage takes so I filtered her (doesn't work on this site tho)
Didn't know she had a YouTube channel
>>

 No.119036

>>119027
As dishonest as talking about yourself in third person?
>>

 No.119045

File: 1627612433417.jpg ( 37.77 KB , 800x450 , pepelaughz.jpg )

>written by french maoist
>>

 No.119050

why are pseuds so easily triggered by cockshott's autism?
>>

 No.119070

>>118474
Autistic people are pretty much forced to confirm and most of them spend their lives trying to do it because they don't know how else to socially manage the situation.
The only """'autists"""" who don't do this are either troons or women autists who aren't autistic at all but are highly socially manipulative and aware and use autism as an excuse for their attention-seeking.
>>

 No.119073

>>118623
>anarchild agrees with succdemfag
Anarfags were libs all along, who'd've thought.
>>

 No.119079

>>119073
I never said I agree with socdem poster, but everything they post is of profound quality, especially compared to the absolute dogshit spewed by others.
>>

 No.119083

>>119079
>especially compared to the absolute dogshit spewed by others.
rich coming from you
>>

 No.119089

>>119083
I guess social progressivism *would* come off as dogshit to a reactionary retard.
>>

 No.119120

>>119089
Your posts arent bad because of social progressivism, they are bad because of your liberal morality of good and bad and its associated thinking patterns fucking leaking from them all.
Literally normal lib but with red symbol and poor people good, rich people bad on top. But that doesnt make a socialist, not even remotely. Maybe just read some good ole M&E on historical materialism. There is like dozen people telling you this and you still cant understand what it means.

Half of your threads in /b/ is simple "rightoids stupid and ugly haha" pictures and "if you want to abolish concept of gender categories as they developed until this point in time, youre reactionary fash" (somehow). Like politics is some sport where you officially join one of two teams and cheer.
Da resistence against the empire just like in star wars! :O
>>

 No.119122

>>118832
Read a book for adults.
>>

 No.119128

File: 1627617290271.jpg ( 49 KB , 313x500 , Adult Theory.jpg )

>>119122
>Read a book for adults.
>>

 No.119130

>>119128
Damb gommies brainwashing our adults!
>>

 No.119194

>>119130
The vulnerable workers need our protection from communist propaganda that turns frogs gay.
>>

 No.119251

>>119120
>you bad red a bok it proves me right
The most rightarded morons are the greatest pseuds.
>>

 No.119363

>>118971
Of course.
You have to force rightarded idpol into the working class to create divisions.
How else are the bourgeois gonna keep the status quo?

Whenever the proles rise too much, tell them that leftism says they are equal to some transhumanist and post a non-passing trans woman.
Don't even need to lie!
>>

 No.120212

>>119251
>Recommending to read Marx makes you rightwing
The absolute state of this place holy shit.
>>

 No.120214

File: 1627713145960.png ( 334.57 KB , 500x500 , cope seethe.png )

>>118069
>>118869
Go back to bunkerchan
>>

 No.120221

>>120212
>red a bok it provs me rite
>won't bring up anything specific because it would destroy the """argument"""
>just "google it"

>b-b-but the bok lefty! tharfor me corect by teling u to gogle it!
>>

 No.120244

>>120221
The point is that he/she/they often uses moral argumentation of the type of "X is true because if you believe otherwise youre bad person" (usually in threads about gender). My post refers to the fact that morality isnt absolute, it is 100% artificially constructed by the currently existing system, and is thus irrelevant to other systems such as the one that we seek to replace the current with. And thus that kind of argumentation based on liberal morality, often used by that anon, is entirely worthless. This is spread out through M&E's writings on topics of historical materialism, which is why i referenced it.

Everything i just wrote was already said or clearly implied in the post you replied to.
The fact that you didnt understand that, nor do you understand the relationship to Marx and Engels, is very telling. Consider going back where you came from.

I didnt quote because this is so basic and so spread out throughout marxist work that it amazed me you unironically demand it. Well here you go, an example out of many possible (Anti-Duhring):
>If it were such an easy business there would certainly be no dispute at all over good and evil; everyone would know what was good and what was bad. But how do things stand today? What morality is preached to us today? There is first Christian-feudal morality, inherited from earlier religious times; and this is divided, essentially, into a Catholic and a Protestant morality, each of which has no lack of subdivisions, from the Jesuit-Catholic and Orthodox-Protestant to loose “enlightened” moralities. Alongside these we find the modern-bourgeois morality and beside it also the proletarian morality of the future, so that in the most advanced European countries alone the past, present and future provide three great groups of moral theories which are in force simultaneously and alongside each other. Which, then, is the true one?
(…)
>But nevertheless there is great deal which the three moral theories mentioned above have in common — is this not at least a portion of a morality which is fixed once and for all? — These moral theories represent three different stages of the same historical development, have therefore a common historical background, and for that reason alone they necessarily have much in common. Even more. At similar or approximately similar stages of economic development moral theories must of necessity be more or less in agreement. From the moment when private ownership of movable property developed, all societies in which this private ownership existed had to have this moral injunction in common: Thou shalt not steal. [Exodus 20:15; Deuteronomy 5:19. — Ed.] Does this injunction thereby become an eternal moral injunction? By no means. In a society in which all motives for stealing have been done away with, in which therefore at the very most only lunatics would ever steal, how the preacher of morals would be laughed at who tried solemnly to proclaim the eternal truth: Thou shalt not steal!
(…)
<We therefore reject every attempt to impose on us any moral dogma whatsoever as an eternal, ultimate and for ever immutable ethical law on the pretext that the moral world, too, has its permanent principles which stand above history and the differences between nations. We maintain on the contrary that all moral theories have been hitherto the product, in the last analysis, of the economic conditions of society obtaining at the time.

In case you care, I'm for abolishing concept of gender, as gender roles and gender identity in the first place were created by old societies for division of labour and therefore will be obsolete. Anon is against because (anon believes) gender categorization is real and its mean and intolerant to trans people who self-identify through these gender identities (MtF etc).

BTW you forgot to call me rightwing this time, smoothbrain.
>>

 No.120264

>>120244
>Everything i just wrote was already said or clearly implied in the post you replied to.
No, it wasn't.
Before, you only said
>you're bad because you have morality of a liberal
That's completely different from
>all morality is 100% subjective

>I didnt quote
I don't mean quote, I mean just explaining what you mean.
Telling someone to "read book x" is something that only pseuds do. It's equivalent to saying
>you're wrong and I'm right and you're stupid and this book proves me right
Philosophy is not biochemistry, you don't need to know tons of specific facts to get it. Vast majority of what is needed is just understanding of language and "general cultural knowledge".
Referring someone to a large book as an argument is brainlet elitism, just like quotes are an argument to authority.

Also, in the quote itself
>any moral dogma whatsoever as an eternal, ultimate and for ever immutable ethical law
it's different from saying
>morality should not be used in an argument
It only means
>morality should not be seen as an eternal "fact"
Which is far from
>we should disregard morality because it's subjective

>Anon is against because (anon believes) gender categorization is real and its mean and intolerant to trans people who self-identify through these gender identities (MtF etc).
[citation needed]

Sounds like you're simplifying way too much.
>>

 No.120279

>>120244
>In case you care, I'm for abolishing concept of gender, as gender roles and gender identity in the first place were created by old societies for division of labour and therefore will be obsolete. Anon is against because (anon believes) gender categorization is real and its mean and intolerant to trans people who self-identify through these gender identities (MtF etc).
This take has existed since 2014 and has aged like milk, while (obviously) the ideal is for the abolition of gender roles its real fucking easy to say that when you are a cis white man who enjoys all the benefits of it. The transgender fams (many of who philosophically support the same gender abolition no less) are actually involved in the direct expansion of those genders and therefore defining a framework (and not an ideal magic wand saying gender be gone!) where gender roles can be abolished. This is of course all quaint to the nearby future where body-hacking will necessarily sweep all sex distinction (and with it most reactive gender discourse) under the table - which retroactively defines 'gender critical' as a reactionary ideology.

Being 'but there should be no genders' is literally no different than the utopian socialism Engels railed against, things are a process and transgenders are a pretty obvious instance of this zeitgeist. Also its fucking cowardly because again youre a cis man who can do nothing but enjoy most of the gender roles that you inherited.

I actually hate talking about this stuff but the trans takes in this board are so fucking bad, that me a cis man with literally no understanding of Butler, find entirely laughable.
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 No.121060

>>120214
seethe and cope
>>

 No.121061

>>120244
>otherwise youre bad person
wow nice strawman. I guess commies and libs are exactly the same after all

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